An HSBC Bank Error Cost Me $105 and a Headache
About a week ago, I scheduled an online transfer to move $1,400 from my checking account to my HSBC savings account. A few days later, HSBC pulled $1,400 from my checking account…TWO TIMES!! During one of my random, daily reviews of my bank accounts, I noticed a big fat, red, NEGATIVE number. *eyes stretched* Huh?
At first, I was more curious than upset. So I began digging around to investigate the problem. It appeared that the HSBC transfer was going to post twice…hmm. I logged into HSBC to make sure I had not fat fingered my transfer request. Nope, just one request. In my checking account, both transfers were pending, so I assumed it was a computer glitch that would work itself out. But nooo! The next day, I receive this email from HSBC:
SUBJECT: Important Update About Your HSBC Account
Dear SINGLE MA
On Friday Oct 30, 2009, there was an error in our processing of transfers that resulted in your account being debited twice. I apologize for this inconvenience. We are correcting this problem and the balance of your account will be up-to-date by Wednesday Nov 4, 2009.
If you incurred any third-party fees due to our error, we will reimburse you. Please log-in to your account and send us a bankmail with your request for reimbursement detailing the fees charged. Any HSBC fees that may have occurred will be reversed automatically. In addition, any interest owed on an HSBC interest-bearing account will be credited to your account accordingly.
I again apologize for any inconvenience this may have caused you. We have put in place processes to prevent this from occurring again.
Sincerely,
xxx,
EVP Personal Financial Services, HSBC Bank USA
Ok, no problem. Banks make mistakes too. They said they’ll reverse the debit made in error and refund any fees. Cool.
Then of course, I get an email notice from my other bank to inform me that I have insufficient funds in my checking account. No surprise. However, not only have I incurred one insufficient funds fee, I’ve incurred THREE at $35 a pop! Here’s THAT lovely email:
SUBJECT: Account Has Insufficient Funds
To: SINGLE MA Account: Account Nickname Ending in xxxx Date: 11/02/2009 Transaction Number: 1 Insufficient funds amount: $83.99 Transaction Paid: Yes Fee Assessed: $35.00 Date: 11/02/2009 Transaction Number: 2 Insufficient funds amount: $100.00 Transaction Paid: Yes Fee Assessed: $35.00 Date: 11/02/2009 Transaction Number: 3 Insufficient funds amount: $1,400.00 Transaction Paid: Yes Fee Assessed: $35.00
Whoa! I was VERY surprised by the amount of fees. I haven’t incurred any of those in a LONG TIME! Obviously banks are hurting and they’ll try to collect fees whenever and as often as they can. Here’s a prime example, look at the email again. Why are the transaction values listed in ascending order of 1, 2, and 3? If they had gone through in that exact order, my checking account balance after 1 and 2 cleared would have been $745.54. Then, only the last transaction (#3 with the extra $1,400 pulled in error) would have incurred an insufficient funds fee – one $35 fee instead of three $35 fees. But noooo, they had to process #3 first, followed by the smaller transactions, to collect a fee on each one of them. Hmph, I’m going to deal with them sneaky bastards too. But for now, I’m focused on HSBC.
So I follow the instructions in HSBC’s email to “[p]lease log-in to your account and send us a bankmail with your request for reimbursement detailing the fees charged.” To make sure my request was crystal clear, I copied and pasted both emails for reference purposes. When I clicked send, the confirmation page said a customer service rep would be in touch within 12 hours. Hmm…shorter than usual for a bank’s online messaging service, but I wanted this fixed PRONTO! Not wasting another minute, I called them up…and this is when I got annoyed.
I explained the problem to the customer service rep and politely requested a refund of the fees. I even offered to forward him a copy of the emails from both banks. Why did this dude tell me I needed to 1) download a form, 2) complete the form to describe the problem and my request, 3) sign and get the form notarized, and 4) fax it to some special refund request department?
*SCREEEEEEEEEEEECH* Umm…how about NO!
Single Ma: This was an HSBC error and I am not going to do extra work because YOU caused a problem with my account.
HSBC Customer Service: Ma’am I understand, but these are our procedures to refund fees. I need to be able to verify the fees you were charged by the other bank.
SM: I really don’t care about your “procedures” right now. HSBC caused a problem and HSBC needs to fix it.
HSBC CS: How much were the fees charged by the other bank?
SM: $105
HSBC CS: $105 for an overdraft fee?!?!?!
SM: *sigh* Tell me about it. But no, it was not an overdraft fee, as in overdraft protection. It was an insufficient funds fee – $35 on three separate transactions – because HSBC took $1,400 MORE THAN I AUTHORIZED!
HSBC CS: *accusatory tone* Ma’am, I will need some verification of that fee?
SM: You have my name, the bank’s name, and the account number that you took the money from. YOU do the work and figure it out.
HSBC CS: May I place you on hold for a few minutes?
SM: Sure. [on hold for 7 minutes - yes, I was counting]
HSBC CS: Ma’am, I just need to verify a few things on the account you have with us and I will forward your request to my supervisor. [run off a list of questions]
SM: [answer his BS questions to verify my identity and ownership of account] How long will it be before I see the refund in my account?
HSBC CS: I will forward your request to my supervisor. If she has any additional questions, she will contact you.
SM: I don’t think you understood my question. How long should I wait to receive my money or call your corporate office?
HSBC CS: May I place you on hold again?
SM: [getting very annoyed] Mm hmm…[on hold for 5 more minutes - yes, I was still counting]
HSBC CS: Ma’am, you should see a credit for $105 in your HSBC account by the end of this week.
SM: That is not acceptable. I want to see a reversal of the unauthorized debit and a refund of the $105 fee within 24 hours.
HSBC CS: [pause] Umm… [pause] …I will note your account and try to get your request expedited.
SM: Thank you.
I am so annoyed with HSBC right now. If they don’t fix this problem – a problem THEY caused – within 24 hours, I’m pulling my money out. All $46,880 of it. I’ve already stopped the $1,000 bi-weekly allotment and I will take my business somewhere else.
The mistake, I can forgive. Fix it and we’re good.
Giving me the run around to fix YOUR mistake? Unacceptable!
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Have you read the Fabulous Financials comment policy lately?
I am SO done with calls like that. Their stupid music, stupid forms, general confusion. Done.
Since I moved everything to Fidelity, I haven’t had any. Good riddance.
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Wow. That just stinks. Not to lessen the impact of what you just went through, but a co-worker banks with TD North and a month ago when they merged with a New Jersey bank, they DEDUCTED the amount of her paycheck rather than CREDITING her direct deposit into her account. It was a nightmare, and she wasn’t the only customer. Our payday was on Wednesday; she didn’t get it straightened out for almost a week.
Good for you for making sure HSBC steps up and does what’s right!
Lawdymercy! I would have had a conniption! But they would have paid me extra for pain and suffering. LOL! [-SM]
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Ugh! That is so frustrating. Sounds like you held your ground though. You kick their butt!
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THIS HAPPENED TO ME TOO! I was moving some NZD to USD ’cause the exchange rate is so good right now. HSBC pulled out my $$ twice, and I FREAKED OUT when I saw that my US checking account had $0 in it last night because of it.
Foolishly, I thought I had accidentally hit the ‘transfer’ button twice when I was moving the money around. It has been a really long time since I made a stupid mistake like that–I should have known better and trusted myself.
Thanks for posting this, I’ll follow up and see that my $10 insufficient funds fee is reimbursed. I also will be following your example and making sure I don’t have to do this crazy notary shtuff overseas. Horrible!!!
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Oooh, I just checked all of my email accounts and the HSBC bankmail. Nada. And my double charge occurred on October 30, 2009, as well!
I plain didn’t receive this email, when it is clear that I should have. I wonder if they are prioritizing their customers based on the amount they hold? Or if they are just trying to sweep this under the rug with the customers with lower investment amounts (I currently have $5K with HSBC). I am getting very angry.
I just wrote them an email, but I will be calling their service center tomorrow morning and plan to bring this up. Again, thanks bunches for posting this, otherwise I would have never known.
I hope your situation gets resolved soon! [-SM]
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I worked for HSBC until they closed all HFC and Beneficial offices nationwide and laid me off. I hate to say it, but this seems par for the course with them. We had a number of situations where mortgage payments were deducted from customers’ accounts twice and getting it all straightened out was just extra work and headache that no one needed.
I wonder if you went to the bank where they pulled the money from and explained that this was NOT an authorized transaction if you would get any further?? They said they will refund the fees, but that will not convince me to let HSBC off the hook. [-SM]
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I love how you dealt with them!
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SM:
I understand your pain the banks are really trying to get over on these crazy fee’s…
BOA just charged me a 35 overdraft extension fee…What in the hell is that? I think this is when an overdraft has not been correct with a deposit within a certain amount of time. [-SM]
Last i check my account wasn’t on a negative now they want to take there time giving me my money back.. It’s YOUR money that you’ve worked hard for, make them fix it. [-SM]
Nope, I am like you 24 hrs or we are done…
Its not the money its the principle of the matter..ITS UR ERROR
FYI- i was so excited to see a blog today..LMBAO
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Dang. You have just inspired a post about my own customer service woes.
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When I initially saw the email from your other bank I was impressed that they started with the smallest balance…until I read on. Banks kill me with that!!! I haven’t had an overdraft situation in a long time and that is exactly what First Union (at the time) did. Mine was due to a friend writing me a bad check (reimbursement for travel we were doing together). I was so angry with the order in which the bank processed the transactions – I closed my account. Now I realize that’s how they all do it.
I love the way you handled HSBC. Keep us updated.
Yes, banks are grasping at straws for whatever fee they can collect. This is a checking account that I use for business purposes and completely separate from my personal cash flow (freelance income, rental income, mortgage payments, etc.). Otherwise, I’d close this account too! LOL [-SM]
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So where would you move your $46K to? Do you have a new bank in mind?
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Wow, this is bad. I am pulling my funds out of HSBC right away!
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I received another email from HSBC. The credit to refund $105 in INSF fees has been processed. I won’t be satisfied until I can actually SEE the credit in my account.
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I’ve been watching HSBC drop its rates from 6% to, 1.75% (or is it even lower now?)
For what it’s worth, I had a very similar situation happen to me with Citibank a few years ago. I fear that they are all the same.
I think to get good service you have to go with the smaller banks.
So far, my best banking experience has been with USAA and they’re pretty large. [-SM]
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You go SM. I would’ve filled out the forms because I wouldn’t know any better. You give me courage to fight for my right! Anyway, I also just switched savings from HSBC to Ally for the rate and also user friendliness of the site. I even called the Ally customer support line and lo and behold they were quite courteous as well. We’ll see how far that goes.
E
Good luck with your new bank! At this point, I only want a bank that’s tried and true. [-SM]
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Happened to me too. Luckily I didn’t incur any damage, but my heart sure did drop when I saw that second $10K pulled from my checking account. I’ve got tons of bills to pay and I was worried. So far, all is good though.
I keep reminding myself that it could have been worse – my checking account could have refused to pay one of the transactions, still charged me an INSF fee, and I would have incurred a late fee from the creditor. Good to hear your situation worked itself out with no problems. [-SM]
I, too, am wondering where you will be moving your money (if you do.) I’ve been thinking of abandoning HSBC well before this happened.
Due to the current economic climate, I’m reluctant to trust a bank I’ve never heard of or one that I’ve never had a relationship with. Although I want to maximize returns, I now place a higher priority on consistent exceptional customer service. With that said, all of my financial needs may end up exclusively with USAA. I’ve considered this in the back of my mind for quite some time, but HSBC just brought it to light. I haven’t made a final decision yet. [-SM]
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i had a similar situation happen to me last week, too, when i reviewed my checking account on oct 30th – weird because i am with a different bank.
i purchased something on r.alph l.auren online and sent it back to be exchanged. during the exchange, errors on my checking account occured.
my account had already cleared the initial charge. i called r.alph l.auren up and they said, when they received the item for exchange, they credited my acct for the purchase, minus shipping, then debited my acct for an even exchange. well they didn’t credit anything. i just had 2 debits as a result of the exchange.
i wanted to know why i now had 3 debit transactions for an item i didn’t even have in my possession. the customer svc person told me to contact my bank because they were positive they didn’t debit me incorrectly a second time. they would not even accept a copy of my bank statement showing the transaction…they just directed me back to my bank.
called my bank and was on hold for close to 20 mins before they told me that all the debit transactions done by v.isa the night before were done twice. then told me i needed to wait until the next day for them to be corrected. they credited my acct for one of the debits from r.alph l.auren as a courtesy until the situation was resolved. all was okay in the morning.
so, could the culprit really be v.isa?
Unless HSBC has some special relationship with Visa, I don’t think so. This was an online transfer from checking to savings only, no credit purchases were involved. [-SM]
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wow.. you rock, i don’t think i would’ve been assertive at all even tho it was their fault and it’s my money. thanks for posting, god forbid it ever happens to me.. but i know i’m not going to let them walk all over me!
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Update: reversal of the unauthorized debit (1400) and credit for the INSF fees (105) posted to my account overnight.
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That sounds like it was pretty frustrating and kudos to you for standing up to them and not letting them make you do extra work due to their mistake.
Glad they got it worked out because I would have hated it for them it you had to call them back!!!
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Well done.
I would have told them that they effectively had taken an un-authorided loan from me and any further delay will incur 18.9% interest. 18.9% is the interest HSBC charge on its credit cards over here (UK).
Over here, you can take a bank to small claims court to sue for interest payments if they do not refund incorrect withdraals by their system
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Good luck finding a great new bank Single Ma, they are out there!! My bank is a small community bank and they are wonderful.
When I had a question about a fee on my account for using an ATM that had a sticker for being no fee, I called and they figured it out, credited my account and called me back all on the same day. There is also a real person answering the phone if you call the main line (they have an automatic line as well so you can check your balances etc).
I think my overdraft fee is $19 (maybe $12?) I try not to have things overdraft :) And it’s $2 for a transfer from savings to checking to cover shortfalls.
Perhaps there is a community bank (or small) like this near you? Maybe some friends have some experience. You could also try calling around. I selected this bank just based on one phone call where I asked what their monthly fee was for checking accounts. When the woman told me they don’t believe in monthly account fees I was in the bank within an hour with my money. I’ve had my accounts with them for over 10 years now.
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Same thing happened to me with an online transfer, and I’m with a no-name bank. When I called, they said the problem was with the ACH transfer service that they use, meaning they’ve outsourced transfers. Could it be that the banks that had this problem all use the same company?
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